Welcome, welcome. You are listening to the mushroom revival podcast. I'm your host, Alex Dora. And we are absolutely obsessed with a wonderful, wacky, mysterious world of mushrooms and fungi. And we bring on guests and experts from all around the world to geek out with us and go down this mysterious rabbit hole and try to figure out what is going on with these mushroom fungal beings. And today we have Marcel joining from Switzerland to geek out with us about mycorrhizal fungi. So, how you doing? Hello, thank
Speaker 1 0:44
you very much for your invitation. Of course, yeah. And
for people who don't know, you and your work, what are you up to?
Speaker 1 0:51
Yeah, my name is Marcel from the writer. I'm born in the Netherlands. And now I'm since 16 years in Switzerland in Zurich. I studied biology in the Netherlands in marketing in ecology. Then I did my PhD in Basel in Switzerland, where I studied mycorrhizal fungi. So, these are fungi that form a symbiotic association with many long plants. And the goal of my study was to found out, find out how mycorrhizal fungi influence a plant diversity of plant communities and plant productivity. And that was really great. So I stayed with mycorrhizal fungi. Until now, since that was 1994. So it's some time ago. Yeah, yeah. And
how did you originally get into mushrooms and mycology? I know, mushrooms are pretty big in Europe, but I don't know if you your family had a relationship or you took a class when you're studying biology ecology?
Speaker 1 1:49
Yes. So I was fascinated by the symbiosis between lawn plants and mycorrhizal fungi. Some of my family they are producing actually mushrooms, so I woke up earlier with them just to eat, you know, but I was just when I got lectures about plant microbe interactions and about soil ecology. I really liked this, this working together the symbiosis between a plant given carbohydrates, sugars and fatty acids to these mycorrhizal fungi and the mycorrhizal fungi taking up nutrients from the soil, and giving it back to the plants and to trace and I thought, that's really cool. And so I did a Master master project on that and then a PhD and as I said, I stayed with with this. Yeah. What,
what kind of mushrooms are? Are some of your family growing?
Speaker 1 2:38
Just just the ones which which grow on the doing from horses? By m&d Yeah. Mushrooms, the one you buy regularly in the shops, so yeah,
cool. And in the Netherlands or Switzerland or islands,
Speaker 1 2:55
they produce a lot of this shampoo do. Also a lot of organic, they are very organic. And when I was 16, I was also getting them and Yeah, amazing. Shops. Yeah, but
that's great. And I'm sure they support your work and your research that you're doing. It's
Speaker 1 3:13
very different, but they like it. Yeah. It's very different. I mean, these are they live. I mean, this is on doing from horses. So it's, it's very different type of mushroom decomposers. So to say compared to Michroma fungi, but yeah, now of course we can talk mushroom, so to say. Yeah,
and would you say that you're equally a plant person as you are a mycologist?
Speaker 1 3:38
Yeah, I would say um, almost. Especially the first years after my study. I'm basically plant ecologist, I would say, and more and more moved into plant microbe or interaction, soil ecology, fungal ecology, but it started with plants and to understand why plants grow very well at certain places, and how they interact with the underground, basically. Right?
Right. And you just wrote a paper about how you could lead this paper about how mycorrhizal fungi can increase yields for maize, particularly up to 40%. Do you want to give kind of a brief synopsis of this paper and what you found? Yeah, the
Speaker 1 4:18
story is actually very interesting. So I'm working, especially in natural ecosystems. So we wanted to the goal of my PhD was to look at the impact of mycorrhizal fungi on plant diversity. So, we observed that if you have these mycorrhizal fungi in the soil, that the diversity the richness of plant species of bowfront, was much higher. So, from my PhD I had a number of different Mike arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi gliomas are now that the names has changed to rise, your focus and rise to Clovis. And so I took them then to the Netherlands, and then we did some field expense, and they worked. And then I came back to Switzerland and actually I got a very stubborn student, a master student, Cassia and she wanted to work inoculates field soil agricultural fields. So what is mycorrhizal fungi? And I said, Yeah, forget about it, don't do it. The farm, the fields are so well fertilized these mycorrhizal fungi, which are especially important when it's neutral, poor soil, they can because they can take nutrients and also important, not in Switzerland, Northern Ireland's, but she said, I really want to do it. So go ahead, I want you. And then we got very nice results. So we had soils from all over Switzerland. And she found that especially clover, which has very thick roots, they benefit from the symbiosis with these mycorrhizal fungi which form these very fine mycelial networks in the soil. And so they take up the nutrients and glow for the growth and also in agricultural soils. So that was still in the greenhouse. And then I got the grant from Swiss Science Foundation to do field integration trials with a few fields. And then we yeah, we increase the scale. And now this last paper, we did more than 50 different agricultural fields all over Switzerland. And so we integrated plots of about one meter, we added a soil inoculum consisting of spores, and in fact that roots of this mycorrhizal fungi and mycelium, we put it in the soil. And then we had also control plots where we didn't add mycorrhizal fungi but just soil inoculum and then, when the farmers stayed, they sold in a mace. And then at the end of the growing season, we came back and we collected the maize plants to look at the effects on yields. And then we observed in some fields up to 40%, higher plant yield higher productivity. So it's, it's very, very interesting also for agriculture, and especially for sustainable agriculture. So you use nature to produce more and I think that's really cool.
And for people who are unfamiliar with the effects of arbuscular mycorrhizal beneficial effects on plants, what what are the many ways that mycorrhizal fungi can help plant?
Speaker 1 6:49
Yeah, so mycorrhizal fungi are underground fungi, the spores are always below ground. So it's not this beautiful mushrooms with many of you probably know. And they form then my Celia in the soil, so many hyphal fragments. And with these hyphae, they can take nutrients, especially phosphorus is also micro elements, such as iron, or copper, or zinc. And they've given these nutrients to the plant roots, and in return, they get then carbohydrates and fatty acids from the plant. And they can actually also help because they, they announced the fitness so to say, of the plant, so they can also make them more resistant to pathogens and diseases. And there are also several studies which show that microphones can enhance drought stress, so they protect the plant give a better connection. So to say to the soil, it's in a way very logical, the plant of course has to grow as to do photosynthesis to make sugar and the fungi, they're just always below ground. So they're really good at getting things from the soil. And so they exchange it and and that's really fascinating.
And, and one of the main insights from this paper is that mycorrhizal fungi helps protect plants against plant pathogens, fungal pathogens, which in turn increases yields, right, since they're not fighting invaders and spending so much energy, you know, trying to fight off things that want to try to harm. So what are kind of the main plant pathogens, that it helps protect, protect plants from?
Speaker 1 8:16
Yeah, so maybe just to go back to why we found that pathogens are probably important, in a way, it's maybe not, not strange, we got the results, we found that on 120 5% of the field, so 1/4 of the fields, that was a significant growth increase between 15 and 40%. Then on two thirds of all fields, 65%, we found a growth increase, but not necessarily negative, not positive, over the significant sorry, but and then on the very few 1/3 of the fields, we found a slight negative growth response. And then we couldn't explain it because of course, a farmer wants to know when he when he applies mycorrhizal fungi should be positive and not negative. And then I'm a scientist in my labs, Steffi Lutz to get together with Natasha Bo knows they were analyzing the microbiome data. So we analyze the microbiome, we sequenced the fungal communities in the soil, also at the start of the experiment already, and also in the plant roots. We also had a primer, which was specific, so we specifically could detect our fingers. And then it certainly turned out that the occurrence of sequences of fungal pathogens, so fusarium, for instance, but but many other pathogens, that they actually explained the positive growth response. And in a way, it's not not strange, because in Switzerland, the fields are very well fertilized. Most are mixed farms. So the farmers have have animals cows, for instance. So they have a lot of fertilizers, and so it's very well fertilized. So that is fungi help to protect against diseases, which of course also reduce crop productivity a lot in agriculture. It's a big problem, of course, in a way, it's not surprising, but we do not know the mechanism. So we only see a very clear correlation a clear pattern, when there are a lot of pathogens in the soil based on the sequences which we around with sequencing with the to assess the microbiome in the soil, we see that then there was a positive effect. Now we're doing greenhouses expense. And we're integrating the plants with pathogens and with mycorrhizae fungi. And so now we're trying to look for the mechanisms. There are some studies already in the literature several studies who have shown that mycorrhizal fungi can provide protection, it's also simple, they can sit in the root. And if the mycorrhizal fungus is in the root, there is no place for a pathogen anymore. That's one mechanism. The other mechanism is simply that they enhance the resistance, make the plants fitter, so that they are more resistant to pathogen attack.
And in the paper, it says that this success rate was around 86%, or nine out of 10 plots that you studied. In the other 14%, or one plot, did you find that there was less pathogenic fungi, so it was less helpful to have mycorrhizal fungi protecting it because there wasn't as much to protect against is that
Speaker 1 11:01
there are two things there's one thing is the effect of the inoculation with these microphones, you're on plant yield on biomass production. And the other thing is, which I think is also very important is the establishments success, that means that we add, we add this mycorrhizal fungus. And then we can see that the fungus which we added was really colonizing the roots. And that was happening in nine of the 10 fields. So about 80 90% of the fields, we found, we added this is reasonable and was irregular, and then we found it back. So that was the success rate. And I think that's very important, because it shows a causal link. Because I've seen some studies of also producers, they add something, and then they found the beautiful growth response, but sometimes they don't even find that affirming fungi coma is the plant roots. So that means that growth effects are due to fertilizers or some other substances, which they apply to the inoculum. But we shall we shall really a link that that the mycorrhizal fungi which we add, was really able to deal with the field conditions. And I think that's very good. We had a very generalist fungi, which could grow as the blazing salts with a low pH. So which were relatively acid to a higher pH with higher amounts of organic material in the soil and lower amounts of organic material, more sand, with more clay and so on. So it's very general, its fingers. And I think that's very important, of course, for the application that is fungus is adapted to a wide range of soil types. So it's not so selective, where it can grow. And then the next thing of course, what's interesting for the for the farmer in the hand, is that that the plant yield is higher, but also there's also companies working on soil health. So they can also help to enhance soil structure make it more aggregated, so it is better resistant to soil erosion, which I'm in Switzerland, so it's quite hilly. So soil erosion is a big problem here. So also that's an application that microphone Yeah, just make the soil structure the soil health better.
And did you just work with a single species?
Speaker 1 12:51
Yes, we worked Yeah, we worked with several fungi, but actually only one as the best very well this this this reasonable one was irregular. And the others they had we did some expense with them also in the field, but they hardly established and had no effect. So we focused just for sake of simplicity, we focused on this one furnace, but I know many people who sell also knock them they put in mixtures and also always the ideas that if you have mixtures that at least maybe one furnace is attached to this soil and other fungus is adapted to that soil so you reduce the risk. But in our case, it just didn't work. So we continue to end with this one fungus but I'm still considering to to apply all us we have also a collection, Swiss collection of arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi with over 50 different I think 90 Different isolates in total. So we can work with them but but this one just works. And of course, you have to remember agriculture is a very, very rural states, it's very disturbed the system it's still there as fertilizer applied. So, you need to have also fungus which is able to deal with this condition. So many mycorrhizal fungi they, they do not cannot handle these conditions, they disappear. So that's, of course for the application also very important.
And obviously, you know, using chemical fertilizers, pesticides, fungicides, is is pretty commonplace in around the world and traditional agriculture. But on the flip side, how common is large scale mycorrhizal application in large scale ag agriculture?
Speaker 1 14:19
Yeah, I'm not so sure. I think, as far as I know, there are a few researchers, of course, and a few companies who are starting now, I think there is a large large potential because it's sustainable agriculture. You can basically add mycorrhizal fungi as a tool to enhance the fitness of plants. So you can then reduce pesticide application or reduce fertilizer application. So the concept is beautiful is fantastic. There are a bit of issues, if you add, you know, you think of, especially in United States, in Europe, the fields are a bit smaller, usually, but if you have hundreds of hectares of maize, then it needs to be also pricey. So I'd say it needs to be cheap so that the farmer can apply it and so on. What is actually interesting is we found in recent paper a year ago that actually finger side application and also pesticide application suppresses the, the activity and the diversity of mycorrhizal fungi. So we actually focused on conventionally managed fields. So well fields where the farmers apply pesticides, because they're the differential are suppressed. So we thought that we have the highest probability to get them back, you know, we bring them in, so they have the highest, we have the highest chance of success. Now, we're actually for this year planning to compare organic fields and conventional fields. And because in organic fields, you usually see higher microbial diversity in the soil, better soil structure, so maybe there's less effective mycorrhizal fungi. But we don't know what we're going to test it now.
Yeah, and honestly, that's, I'm surprised that it works so well in traditionally managed fields, because I always hear from people who work with mycorrhizal fungi that they don't establish well, and fields that have been sprayed and, you know, especially the plants that are trained to just get instant fast it phosphorus, right, that, yeah, at that they're like, yeah, why would I form a relationship with with this mycorrhizal fungi if I'm just getting instant, you know, chemical phosphorus instantaneously. And so that that's been kind of the problem for a lot of people of switching to Mike arisal. Is, that was. So that's great that you're getting good results in that in those fields.
Speaker 1 16:30
One thing, which is I think, also very interesting. So we took soil samples at the start of the month. So in spring, when when the farmers were going to solve the maze, and actually based on the microbiome in the soil samples at the start of the season, we could predict the inoculation success with 86%. So we could predict whether it works or whether it doesn't work. And I think that has also a lot of commercial potential. Because then a farmer can can predict Hey, do I need mycorrhizal fungi? Maybe I don't need to add them. I think that's that's a very interesting application way.
You're talking about cost as a potential hurdle. What do you feel like? Are the potential hurdles for applying large scale mycorrhizal fungi instead of, you know, spraying crops with traditional chemicals?
Speaker 1 17:20
Yeah, I think, at least especially here in Europe, the government is getting more and more critical about pesticide use, more and more pesticides are being banned. So basically, what is now needed also by agriculture is alternatives for the products. And this is for sure one product which is working, but we have to really go to now larger scale agriculture, we're now testing seed coating, with testing granules. So instead of applying fertilizers to the field, we apply mycorrhizal granules. So small granules, where we have the spores and the inoculum is sitting in their reply to the agricultural fields. So we'll have to see if this works and applicable and we have done last year expense with with machines. So with under sewing, so you have one box with seeds, and another box with the mycorrhizal inoculum. And then we at work, so we're now next season, we're going to do more fields. Also, we asked farmers if they have interest to do this. And now many farmers actually they we just had an article in an applied newspaper, many farmers, they wrote to us, please, you can come to us. So it's really nice, but also very important to say we rely on farmers collaborating with us. Because if we want to develop it for the real world, for not in a in a greenhouse study with some perfect soil mixture, where we always get good results, we have to apply it for real world conditions. And so we're going to do it in many different fields and see what what's going on. But it just takes time,
I just want to point out as well, I been saying traditional farming with it, and tying that with the use of chemicals, but that's really not traditional. It's very new practice that, you know, for the longest time, it's been organic agriculture and the use of chemicals in agriculture is a very new phenomena. So I I noticed I was I was using that phrase incorrectly, because it's a it's actually a new new form of agriculture that isn't really working. It's not sustainable. It is working for yields and things like that, but destroying our ecosystems, our microbiome in our soils and our own health, you know, when we when we consume that plant, so this
Speaker 1 19:27
is of course, a bit the problem also for farmers, because the world population is growing and growing and there are many people and they have to also eat, all of us need to eat so they they often have to that's why I think agriculture got so intensive, because we have to do it efficient, we have to produce a lot. And so applying fertilizers applying pesticides is often a very easy way but I think also a lot of research went into that in the 60s and the 50s and so on. But I think the research on biologicals is lagging a bit behind and so I think mycorrhizal fungi but also nitrogen fixing Bacteria also microbes, Trikha Derma, for instance, that help against diseases to make plants more resistant, there's a lot of potential and I also we see now more and more big companies, they also move into that area, but it's a bit more challenging is applying fertilizer, it's very easy. Applying mycorrhizal fungi we show it sometimes it works very well. Sometimes it works less good. So you need more knowledge of your, of your farm or of your soil and so on.
Have you done any research or work with endophytic? fungi?
Unknown Speaker 20:29
No, we haven't worked on that. Really? No. Yeah, it seems
like not that many people are. But I'm so curious about the potentials of it, which just seems like it. You know, they produce, they help the plant produce so many interesting compounds. And it seems like such a vast area of research. But, you know, we're so far behind in, in studying the world of mycology, that you know, we have many years to catch up.
Speaker 1 20:55
There is a lot actually I fully agree and also some of these endophytes they can be really beneficial for the plants, they can protect them to the to her before also to DeWalt and so on. Yes, I fully agree. I mean, I started to work on mycorrhizal fungi. So we moved on with that, but I of course there are other microbes, fungi, bacteria, that can help for sure.
Yeah. And have you done kind of a cost analysis or estimated of, you know, where currently large scale mycorrhizal fungi is compared to traditional pesticides, fertilizers, fungicides, you know, like, how much would it cost a farmer per acre or hectare? To Do you know, mycorrhizal applied inoculation versus, you know, that chemical spraying.
Speaker 1 21:52
Yes, I am not an agricultural economist, so I don't have the prices in my head. But, so I'm working, I'm considering here to Swiss condition. So prices in Switzerland are quite high. But so so we're considering now, an added value added price of 500 to 200 euros. That's what what we're working on. I think I mean, we're just in the, in the very small scale still. So there is maybe room for improvement. But also, I think if you have to buy pesticides, they're also not cheap. So it goes a bit in the same range. And it's, of course, much more environmentally friendly. So I think it has potential, I think it's a realistic price. But with the pricing, I would like to be careful we're doing now I mean, this study was just to show proof of principle. So we show proof of principle, we show that adding mycorrhizal fungi to normal conventional agricultural fields in Switzerland, which are quite intensive, it works. And it can enhance plant yield. The next step, and we're really working on it is to apply them in a in a very efficient way for for a good price. So but I think, and of course, what's also very important, we work with maize, at the moment, which is a main big crop. So the revenues with maize are not so high. And also I think all the companies they work with, with vegetables and so on, sometimes they're the revenues per hectare, they are 1000s and 1000s and 1000s of euros or Swiss francs. So there it's actually even more interesting and we started work on may simply because of the history of my group we were called group called organic herbal farming. Bo aka bow in in German. And so we were working with bass because we've always been working with it. But now we're Yeah, it's a stupid reasons, but it's just them their history. But we see it works. And now we're also considering all the crops we have been doing some first trials also in the greenhouse with with vegetables, even with herbs and some they really like mycorrhizae they really grow better, almost don't care. It's also important to note not all plants, plant species benefit from these mycorrhizal fungi. Some they really don't care, but with maize, and some, some some fagot bowls, it works really well. So but that's the next step. Also, what's very important, we have different results in different fields. So just the next month on one field gifts, it's very difficult to quantify the effects is very important to look at 10 or 20 fields at the same time, because then you get a robust answer.
And did you find it hard? Did you produce the mycorrhizal fungi in house or were you able to purchase it from a commercial supplier? How, how is the sourcing?
Speaker 1 24:27
We have been producing it ourselves in the greenhouse. So it's very simple. We have basically pots, big pots with sterilized soil. And then we add and we add a spores of this one particular mycorrhizal fungi which then colonize the roots and then they form spores in the soil. The roots are colonize the Haifa and that is what we use as inoculum. But now we're also started to collaborate with with a company, which is producing a lot of Mike rice is a German company, and they produce our strain in their greenhouse for setting they're not only green and have tunnels for facilities and we were having are in contact with with various companies to do that is
that kind of the commercial method is growing like a grass or like microgreens and you know big, so many trays of it and then cutting the roots and kind of multiplying from there.
Speaker 1 25:19
Exactly. So you can do it with with sorghum. Some people do it in the United States. I know they do it with sorghum, you can do it with clover, you can do it with maize, you need this the good host, which produces a lot of fungal spores in the end and colonize roots and hyphae. And you can use that soil then. I mean, also, it's very important natural salts to have mycorrhizal fungi. So it's just that if you have very intensive agriculture, by tillage, by fertilization by pesticides, the abundance of these mycorrhizal fungi get reduced. So you have you have to help a bit, so to say to bring them back, but if you do also, what's very important farmers always asked me Yeah, I think I have a problem. I don't have enough mycorrhizal fungi in my soul. What can I do? Then I say you can apply them. That's one way by inoculum from us, for instance, or what you can also do you do a grass Clover pasture. So you have a pasture, which is legumes, which have grasses, they fix nitrogen. So you get biological nitrification fertilizers for free. So to say, earthworms recover mycorrhizal fungi recover. This gives enhanced soil health. And that's a natural way to enhance the mycorrhizal fungi in your field soil. So that's also working. There are different ways.
So after you grow, let's just say for example, clover in you know, a tray, you inoculated it grows out, do you cut the roots, and then pass that soil root mixture through, you know, a series of seeds to filter out just the spores? Like, what's the end product? Is it? Is it a bunch of soil the roots, you know, blended up? Or are you trying to get just this spores left behind,
Speaker 1 26:54
yet are different? They also do people do different things. So what we did we applied solar, no column containing spores, chopped roots, so cut in small parts and containing mycelium. That's just just the end product of the sports. The company is also the ad sports to small granules, they also have this in vitro produced spores in big bioreactor. So I'd say some, some companies are doing that. Or you can also put routes to granules. There are different ways to do it.
Cool, cool. What would you say is that has been the hardest part of this research.
Speaker 1 27:37
It's just a lot of work. So the way we do it is very precise, it's very systematic, because we also analyze the success rate of the fingers as publishing. So it's a lot of work to produce the inoculum, because it's a large amount of inoculum with so we have 800, small, small plots. So to say 50, more than 50 fields, we have to find the farmers, of course, we needed to have funding, some people need to produce inoculum technician in my group, someone has to go to the field, someone has to contact the farmers, we have to cut the cut the plants, then we have to do the molecular analyzer. So we did the microbiome analyzes is PCR and then sequencing. So this also requires different expertise we need to have We also are working at the Research Institute, Agricultural Research Institute, you need to have big cars. And now we're working with machines that you can apply the inoculum so you need to have indoor sewing. It's a Yeah, it's a lot of interaction with different people and different specialities. So it's just a lot of work. But it's also very nice, we're very happy to have this very nice paper in and also in nature microbiology is, is a very nice journal. So we got a lot of attention. So that's why I guess you're speaking with with with me. So it's very nice to see and people see it's it's moving on. So that's potential.
Would you say that's the most rewarding aspect is, you know, finally, finally publishing the paper after all this work? Or what would what would you say is the most rewarding aspect?
Speaker 1 29:05
I mean, on the one, it's the whole process, so just to go to the field. So I'm, I'm now research group leader. So I'm mainly sitting at the computer, have meetings, coordination, but just to go to the field, and then get results and then see how it works. That was really nice. I didn't, as mentioned, I didn't expect it in the beginning. Then also what was for us really nice, we were a bit frustrated, because we got these nice results, but we couldn't explain them. And then we did the sequence analyzed and uncertainly we found say the missing the missing link. That means that we found that these soul pathogens explained the inoculation success. These are of course is successful, but it's also what's very, very important. Have a beer with your colleagues. We have a nice team. And yeah, I think of course if you're if the instruments work everyone is happy and it's good for the spirit and it's of course always nice to be in the field interact with the farmers. I think that's very nice. Then I've got So I can teach them students about this at the university. I'm, I'm working also at University of Zurich, Professor of agro ecology there. So I also that's also very nice, they get an antibiotic about this, and then a few years laters come to us to do a master thesis. So that's also a very rewarding.
So if you had unlimited team money, time, resources, equipment, etc. What would you do?
Speaker 1 30:25
Yeah, we're working a bit on this. So I just got the grant from Swiss Science Foundation. It's called implementation grant, to gradually implement it, bring it into agriculture. So that's one thing. Another thing I think you already mentioned this endophytes to is to make microbial consortia. So a mix of a lot of different things, and see if that really can can boost crop productivity or make crops more resistant to disease. I think there's still a lot to investigate there. So there are for sure, also would invest some money, but now I think, just make it applicable for for farmers. And really, I hope we'll see what's the potential in the end to really make it transfer to the to real practice, I think that will be really cool. And it will have a big impact.
Agreed. And so where can people follow your work? I know you have a Research Gate, I'm not sure if you have a website or any, any ways that people can follow this feature research.
Speaker 1 31:18
Yeah, I've website, University of Zurich, then we have a Twitter account or x. Now, on LinkedIn, we're also sometimes active. And so when we of course, publish our research, so it will also comment will now the next paper takes a few years again, or maybe one year, we're moving on with that. So we're doing also many other things. We look at the importance of soil biodiversity. And we assess microbiomes in soils and see also how microbiome is linked to climate and to agricultural systems, and so on.
Beautiful. Well, thank you for coming on. I appreciate it. And yeah, thank you for everyone for tuning in and tuning in for another episode of the mushroom revival podcast. If you love the show, and you want to support, we don't have a Patreon or any way that you can support directly. But we do have a website mushroom revival.com, where we have a whole line of functional mushroom products, from capsules, to powders to gummies to tinctures and they're all certified organic. And if you want to try them yourself, we have a special VIP coupon code just for listeners. And that coupon code is pod treat. And that's for a surprise discount code, you got to plug it in, we change it all the time. So who knows what you're gonna get. And if you don't want to spend any money. We have a giveaway going on the link is in the description where you can win. We pick one person each month to win some goodies from our site. And we also have a bunch of blog posts on our site from recipes to fungal ecology to you know, psilocybin micro dosing XYZ we have a bunch of free ebooks that you could download and more on our site but a review goes also a long way and just spreading the word about mushrooms and fungi to anyone you meet friends, family, random person in the grocery store. You know, we're all in this together and it's it's an emerging field that is just so fascinating. So more people getting into not only mycology as a whole but just reconnecting back to nature, I think the world would be a better place. So with that much love and meant the spores be with you
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